Timing of SSS56104

Hi,
Everything is in the title. What is the timing of the 56104 500kv ?
Thanks.

I would like to know what timing all others use in their esc too. This motor is very often used. As I burned my Leopard 5692 500KV, and I orderd a SSS56114 440KV, it would be grate to get some input from other users, what timing they set in the esc.
Thanks
Toto

The higher the timing the higher the RPMS you get, but he HOTTER the motor will run and with a little less torque. I did a lot of research on this and because we are using constant power the lower the timing 0 -5% is best to keep torque up, and motor heat down. Its crazy how hot a motor gets when you have timing higher than 8%, I know it can be jacked up to 30% but its not good for our use.

What is timing physically explained ? A check frequency ?
At which level does it operate which explains a 5% increase could be deadly for a motor?

Timing : i guess the same as when you are tuning a car engine : a degree in the rotation just to leave time so things are in right place at the right time, as the change of field and the position of the magnet with the lost during rotation , everything is not always perfect there is a delay and timing is there to anticipate this time

My understanding , easier to measure for a pétrol engine … for me … ( ECU mapping)

deadly with heat when you want to spin it faster when it can or should : 10 degrees for timing : 10 degree in advance before the theorical place in perfect world

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It’s my understanding that a motor with lower timing will produce maximum horsepower at low rpm, and a motor with higher timing will produce maximum power at high rpm. The best timing setting does not necessarily achieve the maximum horsepower that the motor is capable of, but rather produces the maximum horsepower within the rpm range you’re most frequently using. Finding the ideal motor timing setting for your conditions will take a bit of trial and error, but in general, you can expect heavier loads that need quick acceleration will benefit from lower timing setting for more torque. However, if you have a lighter load and/or are running on long straights, higher timing settings may increase your top speed. Just watch the motor temperature; the more you advance the motor’s timing, the hotter it will run. Hope this helps :blush:

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The Timing is about when to switch to the next motor phase (=one of the three wires of the motor). When driving a BLDC motor usually the current flows through two of the three motor wires. With the voltage on the thrid phase the ESC determines when to switch to the next phase. The Timing manipulates when this phase switching occurs.
The physical reason for switching the motor phases or adjusting the timing is to align the magnetic field of the stator with the field of the rotor in order to get the maximum torque for the current used.
In a turning motor the magnetic field of the permanent magnet rotor and the magnetic field you create with the current in the stator windings have to be misaligned by a certian degree for max torque. The stator field pulls the rotor field and thus the rotor will align with the stator field. Then there would be no tourque. That’s why you push the field in the stator further away again. Then the torque stays the same.
A little bit better explanation can be found on the vesc pages under " *Phase advance (other terms: timing adjustment, field weakening)" here: http://vedder.se/2015/01/vesc-open-source-esc/

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Any experience with settings for the SSS56104? I’m currently testing my setup with a flier ESC (24S/240A) with boat Firmware 3.2 (latest) and SSS56104 420KV 6 Poles
I tried several settings, at current best seems to be:
Thorttle curve "linear
Acceleration “soft” (or medium)
Motor Timing 5°
start power “auto”
Full power restriction “100%”

The problem is that it does quite a “jump” when it starts. I read that a small jump is normal as it needs to start commuting the phases at one point but I’m not sure if the gear box will like it :frowning:
Deceleration is smooth until it stops, no sudden stop.
Is this behavior related to using the motor without load?

Yep, sure is.

The SSS 56 motors have a minimum rpm of 1000. It won’t hurt your gearbox without load.
I don’t notice it in the water.
I run 0 degree timing because I noticed lower motor temperatures. I tried 5 and 8 but didn’t see any performance gains. Otherwise all of my settings are the same.

Thank you, I‘ll set it to 0 degrees

@sat_be I had the same problem with my flier ESC too. I set the start up power to 15 % and it fixed the problem.

thanks, I’ll try that out, I tried 5% but that didn’t help.

If it still does it at 15% setting. I would contact flier. I had a difficult time getting mine to run smoothly. Flier sent me an aeroplane firmware to try, and it works perfectly, but no reverse. I think their boat firmware doesn’t work well with the SSS56104 motor. It is important to have it smooth as the clunking is bad for the gearbox.

That’s quite funny as I ordered an airplane ESC with boat SW…
At least it shouldn’t be difficult to flash the airplane sw back. Reverse is not needed anyways.
What SW version were/do you use? I run 3.2 boat.

The one flier sent me is " air24S_UV30"
If you want, inbox me your email address and I will send it to you.

Thanks for the offer, I tried different firmware versions already, they can be downloaded through their flier SW tool. I think the one you use is not in the list. I bought the airplane version 24S 240A, do you also use the 240 A version or a higher one (400A). To me it’s not clear which SW can be used on my HW. Therefore I might try some more versions available in the the list of the flier tool (assuming I only get compatible versions in the list as the sw recognizes the HW). I already tried the airplane version air24S_V31, and boat24sV30, they were worse than the one I started with (boat_24SV32). Does anyone know what the U stands for? There are several versions named UV3x. I’m also in contact with flier but their engineer is busy and the answers from sales are not very helpful (telling me to use 15 for timing and 30% for start power when I asked for a smooth start).

Hi Daniel,
I just sent you the Firmware that worked for me. I hope it helps. My ESC is a 22s 400amp waterproof boat version. I used 15% start up power, 0° motor timing, linear throttle curve and slow acceleration. I have have absolutely no jerking on start up at all.

It starts smoothly now, with Boat24S_V32 with 0° and 20% start power. ESC is 240 A airplane model with boat SW, therefore I didn’t install your image, thanks anyways. Motor is SSS56104 420KV.
Although set to 20% start power it begins to turn smoothly at about 12% (acoording my remote) without initial jump. Flier also told me that their 240A version only supports 120A continuous current and and might burn if you go higher…

That’s great. I’m glad you got it sorted. My remote is the same. Nothing happens until about 12%
Cheers

Sounds like I need to change my flier esc firmware! Can you send me a copy too?